Are you ready to hear the story of how service provider Kate Ahl became the go-to Pinterest expert?

We all know that building a successful service-based business comes with many mindset shifts and important pivots, so it is important to note that this is not an overnight success story!

Kate talks to us about creating a course and then deciding it wasn’t for her, building a team, and what mindset work she had to do to get to where she is today. We also get into how to use Pinterest as a service provider because I definitely wanted to hear all of her thoughts on this!

Kate Ahl is the owner and founder of Simple Pin Media, a Pinterest management company. They help their clients focus back on their business by taking over all aspects of Pinterest marketing. After working with over 600 Pinterest accounts, they have learned how to pin for all types of companies and niches.

Kate has taught tens of thousands about Pinterest marketing through various speaking engagements and her podcast, the Simple Pin Podcast. She aims to teach simple, actionable tips to help you create forward movement in your business instead of feeling overwhelmed.

Value Bombs:

    • You can’t compare your business model to somebody else’s model
    • Taking action to gain clarity on what you want to create
    • Using Pinterest as a service provider to land clients
    • Using Pinterest as a course creator or content marketer
    • How to capture awareness on Pinterest
    • Using Pinterest as an email list building tool
    • Why you need to keep your blinders on as a service provider

    This episode is so jam-packed full of advice, mindset shifts, and tips for service providers looking to grow their business. I hope you got just as much value out of this conversation as I did!

    If you’re a Pinterest manager or you’ve thought about getting on Pinterest, this is a great time to do it! You can learn more about Kate’s membership at!

    If you’re like Kate and you’re ready to go out and create your second stream of revenue for your service-based business with a course or membership, head over to to apply to join us for 2021!


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    Read Full Transcript

    Brandi Mowles: [00:00:00] Today, I have a very special guest, and that's Kate from simple Pan Media, and I'm not even to you that I'm kind of fan girling over here. Kate was one of the very first podcast I ever listened to in my career when I was just getting started as a VA and learning all about Pinterest. And so for her to reach out and want to be on this podcast is super special for me. And we're talking all about agencies. Pinterest braiding, of course, as a service provider, getting visible as a service provider. We covered so many topics in such a small amount of time. This is jam packed with knowledge bombs. And I can't wait to hear your biggest knowledge from.

    Speaker3: [00:00:41] Welcome to the Serve Scale Soar podcast, the podcast dedicated to helping service-based entrepreneurs scale their online business to five figure months so they can soar into six figure years, your host, Brandi, is a wife, mom and in less than one year created a six figure business. And now she is spilling all her secrets. So you can to.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:01:07] Serve Scale Soar family, I am so excited because I have came here from simple pan media and I am just so excited to chat with you. I was just telling Kate before we jumped on here that her podcast was, I'm pretty sure, the very first podcast I ever listened to when I got started as a virtual assistant and really dug into being a Pinterest manager. And now we have you on the podcast. So this is exciting. So, Kate, tell my audience a little bit about who you are as a person and then also about your business.

    Kate Ahl: [00:01:35] Yeah, well, first, thanks so much for listening to the podcast as you do a podcast. And you're like, is anybody listening to this? Like, you don't get a whole lot of feedback. So as a person, I am a strong Enneagram three. I love the Enneagram, which means I am a huge achiever. So I love to think in goals and patterns and all of that good stuff. And of course, during the time of covid, I miss my friends so much. So I'm a big people person. I have three kids. I'm married for 19 years and I have my office here in this shed in my yard. That's me as a person. And then business wise, I run a Pinterest management marketing agency, Simple Pan Media, and started it seven years ago to really help people learn how to market on Pinterest because people are really confused. They were like, I don't know what to do with Pinterest. I use it personally, but I don't know how to use it for business. So I dove in and that was really one to three clients in. And I said, hey, if this works great and if it doesn't, don't tell anybody. We'll just consider it all a wash. And it worked. And later we have one hundred and twenty clients and our membership and 30 employees. It's crazy.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:02:45] That's so insane. And I'm so glad that we're going to jump into this and talk about how you really built this agency, but also how the membership is kind of like the Sprunt in your agency is the back and also how you became known. I would love to chat about this. I'm guessing partly because of your podcast, but I can't wait to dove into, like, how you became known as the go to person for Pinterest and chat a little bit about the relationships you both, because I know that I've downloaded your lead magnet with Tailwind, and so I would love to also dove into those partnerships as well. A little bit south one, Enneagram three. I'm going to need room eight. But my strings finder, my no one's a keeper so much. Ok, got it. Yeah. So I like whenever anyone tells us, like they're enneagram, they're human designed. So that's always fun information. And so let's jump into how did you actually get started in the online space.

    Kate Ahl: [00:03:40] Yeah, I was helping a friend who had a Froogle Deal blog at the time and this was like twenty twelve. We're coming out of the recession. She was teaching people how to coupon. Right, because people were still really struggling with the whole economy. And we were, too. My husband had tried to get a job. He lost his job in two thousand nine and then again in twenty twelve. And so we were just trying to make ends meet. And so she said, why don't you come and learn how to blog, learn how to do Facebook marketing for me so we can really take this to the next level because she was teaching coupon classes and all of that. Well late twenty thirteen. We were really out of unemployment. We were living on food stamps. I had three little kids and I was at her house and she was like, hey, I know a lot of people are going to Pinterest because Facebook has basically changed their algorithm. Nobody can get their business pages to be seen anymore. So they're flooding to pinterest and nobody knows how to use it. You should really manage people's Pinterest pages. And I was like, that's the dumbest idea I've ever heard. Nobody is going to take me up on that. They're going to think that's lame. And she said, you have no other options. Like you have no money coming in the door. You have nothing. And I was like, well, she's got a point. So I searched her name and what would fit? And I thought, well, we'll start it and then see how it works. So it was really just trying to figure out, can Pinterest work for a marketer? And I think at that time, I was really one of the first to start to ask that question because people were still hanging on to Facebook going, it's going to come back. You know, that's what we do in the online world. Sometimes when things change is we say it'll come back, it'll come back, it'll come back. So all of it was self taught and really making a lot of mistakes in this beginning. Marketer online world. And then just watch what a lot of other people were doing. And that really helped get me into the weeds of it all pretty much right away.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:05:29] I think that that's so interesting is so many my listeners have Dmae inside like they started because their family needed food. That's why I started. My family got to a point. We needed food. And it's so amazing how something that feels like so drowning in that moment can be the thing that really pivots how we're working our life and living our life and then what that comes from. And so I love that piece of it. And then also, I like that you said that you figured it out on your own. I think a service providers, one of the greatest gifts that we have is we're in the back end of people's businesses. Like we have more knowledge on how anything worse than anyone else because we're in it. And so I love that. So then tell me about like where did the simple Primedia podcast, when did that come into play? Did you already have a full client roster? Where did this podcast come in?

    Kate Ahl: [00:06:18] Yeah, probably late. Twenty fourteen. When we had started the business, it was still very much this just need to survive. Right. And I was working with these few clients saying, OK, tell me, give me all the feedback about services. How is this working for you, because as a service provider you realize you're taking a piece of someone's business off their plate. Like you said, you know everything about the back end of it and you know how tough it is for them. So those people started to tell more people, tell more people. And I started to get these requests that in November of twenty fourteen all of a sudden had a ton in my inbox. And then I went out to the living room. I told my husband, I'm like, are we going to do this? Like, is this going to be legit? Because right now my brain is still seen as legit. And he's like, let's do it, let's go for it. So I actually hired a business coach because I realized that I was basically tripping over my feet. I did not know what I was doing. And so when I hired him, he helped me get a lot of that organized and then said, OK, it's time for you to start establishing your name in this space. And at the time, somebody had been recording a Pinterest podcast for those previous two years, but she stepped away from her business suddenly. And so there is basically this gap at this time that nobody was teaching on Pinterest marketing. And he was like, you got to go for it. Like, now is your time. You just got to do it. And I was so scared. I'm like, what if I sound like an idiot? What if I don't know what I'm talking about because you just have to do it. So I started it and realized I loved it because my number one in the strings finder is communication. And so it's like my jam to be able to do video or to do podcasts. And I found that I was better able to communicate and teach in that way to where people could understand what I was doing and I could break it down into simple action items like I don't want things to be confusing. And so that propelled my teaching. And I think how I was known both through building my email list during that time too, because that was one of the first things he set me up with was build your email list, do you a freebie. So we did our signature planner and then we went to the podcast. I think those two things of just delivering and just giving people really good value was what really leveled me up during that time. And I did have the advantage that really there wasn't anybody else teaching on it at the time.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:08:32] I love this. And I know some of my audience, though, is making excuses right now. And they're going to be like, well, Kate got in there early because there wasn't another Pinteresque. But if there's someone now that's like a Facebook ad manager or a Pinterest manager, OBM, whatever it is, would you say just because there's other podcasts out there that they shouldn't start one?

    Kate Ahl: [00:08:50] No, definitely not, because everybody has a different perspective. Right, to start that, because people need to hear your voice and your perspective. How I teach on Pinterest might be totally different than how somebody else teaches. And I think one of the things you have to do is figure out how you're wired, figured out how you teach and what your value add is. Don't look at what somebody else is doing because that's going to distract you away from how you're built and created to deliver this message to people. I mean, I look around even at Facebook ads, agencies, there's a ton out there. There's a ton of ways that people see these perspectives because of their learning of how they've worked with clients. And one of the advantages that you have is you have a certain perspective with the people that you've worked with. So absolutely do it and create a different spin on it. That works uniquely for you.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:09:42] I love that. And then the other thing is you're strategic because it's not just putting out a bunch of content, like you're building that email list. You have the lead magnet. You're not constantly changing that lead magnet. As long as I've been listening to podcasts, I feel like it's been the same one. A new one comes out each year. And so I love the simplicity in that. And then also the great thing about podcasting, I think, is people hear you on podcasts and you instantly have authority. It's not like other channels, which a lot of times we dictate by the social proof. So how many likes followers? Things like that. But podcast, the only really social proof you have is reviews. But you could have like a thousand downloads a month and still have more reviews than someone who has ten thousand downloads a month. And so it's just like really nice, just level playing field with people where they're coming to you and listening because they love what you're putting out and they come back week after week and it's not so much like, oh, but she only has four hundred followers. She's not an expert.

    Kate Ahl: [00:10:41] Yeah. Such a great point too. And I think you realize that a podcast allows you into like a really intimate part of people's lives where they're at the gym, they're driving, they're getting ready in the morning. So it's a different type of connection that I agree with you. It's so much deeper than the social proof metrics of likes because that only goes so far. Anybody can make a photo and it doesn't require a connection.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:11:04] Yeah, I love that. So tell me what. Did you go from, OK, we're going all in on this and then start making like serious life changing money to having a podcast, and where did this all time frame happen?

    Kate Ahl: [00:11:19] In twenty fifteen? It was really the foundational pieces to say, how do I position my business in a way that tells people that I have authority in this space but shows what our services are. So at that time we were just offering services of consultations and do it for you, Pinterest management. And then later in twenty fifteen was when we really wanted to dove into podcasts content with blog post content. So I added that site to really level up the team. And then the question was, do we need a product like do we need a course or do we need a membership? And that created a totally different side that I wasn't really prepared. I didn't know how to take it on. And I think as a service provider, you're so committed to your clients that sometimes you can feel like if you step away from that a little bit, am I pushing my clients away a little bit or am I not giving them enough attention? Will they feel like I'm not giving them enough attention? So I really wrestled with this whole idea of like what products to create for people. But I knew that there were people who couldn't afford our services to because we were continuing to raise prices, as you should, with being a service provider. So we wanted that pathway. But to your point earlier about looking at what other people are doing that really got caught up in that comparison trap of looking at what other courses were created out there on the market, more so than what I had to offer. So I want to say, like, twenty, sixteen, twenty, seventeen, we were really growing and scaling and my team was growing too. And I was trying to figure out how to create this course. But I kept looking to other people and I realized, like I'm comparing myself to a course creator when I'm a service provider and it's easy to look at income reports and go, oh, this course creator made one hundred grand and I sold my course and I made 20 grand. Right. And my business coach was so great at that time because he's like, but what did you make on your services? You did make 50 grand on your services plus 20 grand on this, and you're comparing apples to oranges.

    Kate Ahl: [00:13:18] You can't compare your business model to somebody else's model. So I feel like that was kind of a crisis of business for me to really carve out who I was. So actually the course I created during that time, I completely shut down because I felt like it was so hard to keep up with. It required so much updating. Right, because we're dealing with Pinterest. And then we began to create the membership in mid spring. Twenty nineteen. And that felt like it fit like a glove. It was like, oh, this fits for me. It's teaching in real time and it's really connecting. So I feel like all of that kind of leveled up at the same time that clients were growing and our team was growing. But now it all meshed in that late twenty eighteen to really make sense.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:14:02] I love this because you're not in the story, because sometimes it's so easy to look at people and be like, oh, they're an overnight success and it's very rarely an overnight success. You just didn't see all the work that you put in before because you either didn't know their name. You don't know what's going on in the back of their business. And so I love that you're like laying it out like this was not an overnight success. This was a lot of, like, mindset shifts. It was also like personal growth and then also business growth, leaning in on a coach and stop comparing yourself. And one thing i think that service providers don't realize is they have such a unique take on courses and memberships like they know the parts that the person who's like in there, like someone who's just teaching pictures because they did it for themselves, that's way different than someone who's teaching pinschers that did it for a ton of other people. Like, it's just so different. And I think that so many times as service providers, they don't feel like they're experts enough to be teaching this because they're not doing it for themselves. But you're doing it for so many other people, which is so much more powerful, in my opinion. And then you also have that other stream of revenue that your services I always say, like they're so cash flow positive, like it's just coming in where courses they take time to grow. It's not like a one hundred K overnight. It's something that takes time. And so when you can mesh those like you have, that's when like the real magic happens and you really see the revenue grow. I would love to know as you go back and you talked about how your first course you totally got rid of. So tell us about that decision.

    Kate Ahl: [00:15:35] I felt like teaching Pinterest, like I said, was always there and it was what I wanted to do. But I created the course with the idea of somebody else's course in mind. So it was great and it was broken down into modules and it was all these things. But I felt like it was so labor intensive that throughout that years we were working through updates and people needing me. I felt so exhausted as a business owner because not only was I growing a team and I'm very much wired with a leadership skill and helping to. Your team and build them up and create systems, I love that and I love watching people come into my business who are way smarter than me, who have way more creative ideas. And I want to empower them to run with it because that's the gift of hiring a team. But I also had all these customers on the course side who kept asking me questions. They were frustrated when they would open up a video and it wouldn't look how they thought it was going to look. And they were all confused and I felt exhausted. How am I supposed to navigate these two pieces of this business and know where to put my brain? And so late? Twenty eighteen. I thought I'm so tired of updating. It's costing us so much money to update. And truly my heart isn't in it and I don't love it. And if I'm going to teach something to somebody, I want them to know that my energy in my heart and all of that is in it. And I think there was an element to your point of like service providers work on so many other businesses, we don't really always have time to work on our own. You do get caught up in this influencer trap, if you will, that like I want to be seen as the person with the biggest Pinterest account or the most awesome whatever. But yet that's what I'm doing for my clients, such and teaching my team to do for my clients. And so if you get caught in that, it distracts you from that main focus. During this time, we were also had entered into fostering as a family and we gotten a baby and we went through two years of just excruciating court cases and ups and downs and adoption.

    Kate Ahl: [00:17:36] And then she went and returned to her biological father. And so not only am I dealing with this business crisis, I'm also dealing with a personal crisis that's requiring deep grief in my life. And so what I learned during that time was just to pare down and get rid of everything that was dragging me down. And the course was just one of them. And then they gave me the space to actually come up for air to go, OK, what do I really want? Not so much like a cake business perspective, but like a want for the people I'm serving. I really, truly do care about the business owners that enter into my business. Like I want your business to release you to do something else that you love. That's what I believe for my life too. So I want my teaching to be one hundred percent. I don't want you to get the leftovers that we'll say. Releasing that course and being done with it allowed me to come up for air, get a breath and go what fits us. Like what? It's simple pan what fits Kate and then make a different decision. I think we're so afraid as business owners, especially service providers, like we're just afraid to let go of things sometimes because we're like, I think this will work. I'm just going to keep trying and keep trying. And sometimes you just got to go. It's not going to work. And this just it just didn't work.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:18:50] And do you think that if you wouldn't have went through that experience with the course, like creating it, going through that, you would have figured out like this membership is what I love. This is what I want to be doing. Do you feel like you had to go through that with the course to figure out the membership?

    Kate Ahl: [00:19:04] Yeah, you bet. And I definitely had to go through the whole comparison trap game. I had to sort that all out. I had to go through this constant need to get it right. I had two business coaches so far and this was my second business coach. And I was like, man, I just want to get this right. And she's like, Do you realize how often you say, get this right? And do you realize there is no, quote unquote right way to do it? The experts are, quote unquote, might tell you there's a right way, but it's really the way that works for your business to where you can serve people.And had I not gone through these pieces and as an Instagram three, my greatest fear is failure. So, I mean, it's giving up something you're saying you can't do. It is like failure, right? Just all that stuff I had to go through personally to then come up for air. And so go on. Now I know what I want now I'm not. I held so tightly to getting it right. Like there's a lot of agility you can have in a membership to it. Just a lot more freedom with my personality. I don't know. It just I had to go through that really hard time to get to where I wanted. And nobody wants to go through that. Nobody wants to be like sign me up for the business failure class, because that's going to be awesome. Let's just it works.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:20:15] Yeah. And I one hundred percent agree with all that. I think, especially as service providers. And when I'm talking to my students and Beta to Biggie, they're so concerned like whatever they create now is going to be the end all be all like it's got to be the thing that works. And it's usually not. I mean, maybe you hit a home run and it is, but most of the time, like, you got to at least take some action to get the clarity you need to create the thing that really liked you up. And you have to go through that in order to figure out what that is. So I love that you shared that, Kate. And so my question is, who was your first hire? So you said you have a team now of thirty people. How many of these are employees, contractors? And who was the first person you hired?

    Kate Ahl: [00:20:55] The first person I hired was a good friend of mine at my church. And my daughter actually was suddenly diagnosed with Type one diabetes, the first year of business, July eight months in. I was in the hospital. I was messaging all my clients, I'm like, I just need to know, I just need a couple of days, I'll work on a promise. And they were also gracious, right? But I realized in that moment, like, I need a number to like I need an emergency person. So I sat down with her because I knew she wanted a job, part time work at home. And I said, I can teach you everything that I'm doing. I need you just to do this. And so as I brought her on, I realized, oh, I love this really nurturing people, bringing people in. And I have an opportunity to help people have a second job like that. Could be super cool to like all these moms who maybe never thought they'd go back into the workforce. I can teach them the skill and then it will be our methods and all that kind of stuff. So that was the first hire in twenty fourteen and then late twenty fourteen. When I had that business coach, I hired two other friends that I knew locally, taught them what I was doing and crunched the numbers to see how much I could pay them and afford with profit margin. And then it was like people just started coming along locally and I made a decision at that time which not all my team members are local now, but it made a decision to hire locally because I wanted the face to face connection. I wanted this community here, too, as well. So I live in Portland, Oregon. Most of the people who are here in the Portland Vancouver area, they're all local. But I do have some that are ones in Ohio or Maryland, but we all merged to employees back in twenty twenty. I had contractors for a while and then we got to a point where the company rolled into an S corp and we felt like with a lot of the freelancer laws that were happening and the ways in which our company had a structure, it was just really wise for us to go to employees, which was another really scary thing, too, because you just think, like, now I'm legit. Like, I can't. This is just different. So we merge to that. And that's probably been one of the best decisions that I ever could have made. And then we do have a few contractors that we use here on the side. But I was the majority or part time. So there work at home moms who only want to work about 20 hours a week. And then we have a leadership team that is mostly full time.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:23:10] I love that. And one of the things that really stuck out that you said is for me, I've never wanted an agency like we have a team on my core side, not on my service side. And so one thing that I always see that I feel it's a big mistake is people don't look at those profit margins before they bring on subcontractors. And that's the first thing you said you did, is you are looking at the profit margins to make sure that it made sense. And everyone always things like, I have this thing against agencies. I don't I think that you have to look at your numbers. And too often people aren't looking at their numbers and they're not priced according to be able to hire subcontractors.

    Kate Ahl: [00:23:48] And you have to be wired for it, too. I mean, there's an element of like you have to like having a team of people, you have to like being reached out to or being the person who really does steer the ship. And a lot of people feel like that knocks them off their creativity game or it's frustrating. And if that's you, that's fine. I agree with you. Like there's no one size fits all or agency or not an agency. It's are you wired and can you make money? Because you're right, you don't want ninety percent of your profit margin going towards a team and you're coming away with ten and then you have to take twenty percent off that for taxes. So it's all those number crunching. And I realized I could do it. And so why wouldn't I scale it and then let these people make money too.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:24:30] Yeah. I love that in our whole team is also mom, so I love being able to help other moms have businesses. So I love that we're on the same page with that. So before we jump into the Rapid Fire and wrap this up, this has been so great. I want to ask one final question, and that is with Pinterest. Do you think that service providers need to be on Pinterest themselves in order to land clients, or is this something great for, like, course creators or content marketers or bloggers?

    Kate Ahl: [00:25:00] I think Pinterest is great for anybody who can educate as the top of their funnel or the front door to what they're talking about. So for us, the service providers, we use Pinterest because we want to get people onto our email list, because then they can get into our ecosystem and learn about what we do. And so there's a lot of how tos or educating around Pinterest marketing. So if you have the ability to do that as a service provider, asking questions like why should I hire this type of X, why should I hire a designer or even using the tool to coordinate with your clients, I designers or people doing branding or anything like that. Pinterest can be a powerful one to one client tool that you can use. But the biggest thing to realize is that Pinterest users, they're in a place of gathering information or dreaming or wanting to look for something. They're not always at the decision making point. So if you have a point in your business where you want to capture awareness or you want to capture people's attention, Pinterest is the place to do that. But it's not necessarily always going to result in here. Sign it for Pinterest. Management services, like it's not going to go that quickly, whereas Instagram, you can sometimes get that quicker connection right away or even the quicker dopamine hit. Right, like Instagram or other tools that give you that quick hit feel better. Whereas Pinterest is like Google, it's this thing that you're nurturing for the long term because you know that people are going to be searching for when to hire or how to hire. How do I do branding or something like that? So it is a good tool, but it has to be in how you use it. A lot of people just see Pinterest and they start spinning like crazy and they're like, I'm just going to put up all my stuff. Nope. I use Pinterest because I want to grow my email list. That's number one. I don't so much care about how much traffic I'm getting, but I care about awareness and getting people to sign up for my free planner.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:26:55] Yeah, I love that. And so real quick, I know I said that was the last question, but you just brought up the plane. Did you reach out to tell when or did they reach out to you to team up with you? Because the plane was both right?

    Kate Ahl: [00:27:06] It used to be, yeah. So actually, the plane was started by a simple pin in twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen. We partnered in twenty seventeen. And then when we kind of peeled back the partnership, it was totally amicable. It wasn't anything crazy, but we started to kind of peel our brands a little bit apart again. So there you both are, the same name, which is a little bit confusing, but that's how it happened. So first two years s tail end and then going forward, we still have it. And then we decided this year we'd have to planer for so long, we decided to do something totally different and create a key word planner. So it's a Pinterest key word planner. That's again, like 18 pages of key word ideas that you can use for every every season. You name it, it's in there. So we tried to diversify that a little bit, but that's a great question and I get that quite a lot.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:27:57] I love it. OK, so real quick, we'll run through some rapid fire and then if you have any final thoughts and also where my community can find you. But this does not have to be the first word, just the first few things that come to your mind. What is your favorite part of your business?

    Kate Ahl: [00:28:11] Leadership and my team.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:28:13] I love that. I don't think anyone's ever said that on the podcast. OK, best piece of business advice you've ever received.

    Kate Ahl: [00:28:20] Don't chase someone else's business success.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:28:23] Oh, that's a good one. Yeah. Yeah, I think we all need that reminder. Sometimes it's so easy to play comparison with, like Instagram highlight reels and things like that. What does success mean to you?

    Kate Ahl: [00:28:35] It means being able to work on my business, not always in my business, and then releasing in our family to do other things that we love or reach goals that help us achieve freedom, both financially and then mentally and vocationally.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:28:49] I love that because you travel quite a bit, right? Well, before

    Kate Ahl: [00:28:53] We recovered, yes. Yeah, I do. Especially speaking. I do that quite a bit and then I'm able to bring my family with me, which is pretty fun.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:29:02] I love that. OK, and final question. What choices has your business opened up for you?

    Kate Ahl: [00:29:07] I think it's opened up the ability to really choose, like who I work with and how I really curate content for people and being more selective instead of in this, like, feast or famine mode. Now, the choice is really more the luxury of choice. Right. And being able to choose something based on what I want to do instead of based on what I need to do to survive,

    Brandi Mowles: [00:29:34] I love it. Well, this has been so amazing and where my audience connect with you more. Do you have any final thoughts for us?

    Kate Ahl: [00:29:41] Yeah, I would say connection is always simple. Pan media, dotcom or I'm as simple pan media and on all channels. And then the podcast, simple PIN podcast. And I think the final thing I was just like people with is like as you're wrestling with who you are as a service provider or even creating a membership or whatever it is, really be thinking about how you're wired and what you love and really try to keep your blinders on and not look at somebody else's business because you have great gifts and talents to offer and those can really infuse into your services and your products if you keep your eyes on your own page.

    Brandi Mowles: [00:30:16] I love that. That's beautiful. Thank you so much for being on the show and sharing this episode. You bet. Y'all, how good was that, I mean, seriously, between going into all the mindset that Kate overcame, also how she was able to use her podcast to leverage her services and really become the go to person in the industry, and then how she completely got rid of a course after she created it. And let us know that the course you start with does not have to be the end all, be all and just all the ups and downs and reminding us success never happens overnight and to always keep our blinders on. This podcast was so good. So we have a special link for you. So in the show notes you can grab her free download with all those keywords. So if you're a Pinterest manager, you've thought about getting on Pinterest. This is a great time. And if you want to learn more about her membership, just go on and download and get all of the juicy details. So we will link that up in the show notes for you. So you have access to that. And I cannot wait to hear all your amazing DBMS. And if you're like Kate and you're ready to go out and create your second stream of revenue for your service based business with a course or membership, then head over to and apply to join us for twenty twenty one in our Beta to Biggie program, where I take you through 12 months of group coaching. One on one calls critiques weekly Q&A and more on going from a loose idea to a six figure launch over the next 12 months. So if you're like, Yes, Brandi, let's do the dang thing. Go to and apply today and until next week, you all go out, serve your clients, scale your business and soar into the six figure year you deserve.

    Speaker3: [00:32:06] Thanks again for tuning in to the Serve Scale Soar podcast with your host, Brandi. If you loved our podcast, please be sure to leave a comment or review and be sure to tune in next time.

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    Meet Brandi

    Brandi Mowles is the host of the Serve Scale Soar podcast which is a podcast dedicated to helping service-based entrepreneurs scale their online business to five-figure months so they can soar into six-figure years. Brandi is a wife, mom and in less than one year, created a six-figure business.   Now she is spilling all her secrets so you can too.

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